[MM-MALTS-L] CELP & seaweed

Paul Dejong Paul_Dejong at telenet.be
Thu Aug 30 16:27:01 CEST 2007 

I can see your point, Lex.
Maybe I had the ³advantage² when I went to the hague 2 years ago, that they
openly told me when I said I wanted a bottle, and upon asking what sort of
weed it was, that it was not real seaweed but a fresh-water weed they
used... They even gave me a reason why they could not use real seaweed
(although that reason escapes me at the moment...)
But yes, why not email Maurice Van Wees and ask him? I¹m sure he will
explain!

Paul.


On 30-08-2007 16:09, "Kraaijeveld A.R." <A.R.Kraaijeveld at soton.ac.uk> wrote:

> It may have started as a joke, no problem with that, but marketing something
> as containing seaweed when in fact it doesn¹t contain any seaweed at all isn¹t
> exactly honest in my book .... if there was no intention to fool the customer
> then why talk about seaweed? Personally, I do feel cheated.
>  
>  
> slainte, Lex
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> 
> Fly, you greatest fool
> Why can't you say what they want you to
> Why can't you do what they taught you
> And show what they wanted of you
>        
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>  
> 
> Dr Alex R Kraaijeveld
> 
> School of Biological Sciences
> 
> University of Southampton
> 
> Bassett Crescent East
> 
> Southampton
> 
> SO16 7PX
> 
> United Kingdom
> 
> tel: (+44)-(0)23-80593436
> 
> fax: (+44)-(0)23-80594459
> 
> http://www.sbs.soton.ac.uk/staff/ark/ark.php
> <http://www.sbs.soton.ac.uk/staff/ark/ark.php>
>  
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>  
> 
> 
> From: mm-malts-l-bounces at grsnet.net [mailto:mm-malts-l-bounces at grsnet.net] On
> Behalf Of Paul Dejong
> Sent: 30 August 2007 15:03
> To: malts-L MM
> Subject: Re: [MM-MALTS-L] CELP & seaweed
>  
> Hi Lex and all,
> 
> Celp indeed contains a fresh-water plant called elodia, but don¹t go down the
> path of a ³conspiracy theory²
> The whole thing started of more or less as a joke, and Van Wees had no idea
> the thing would be so succesfull. The first batch was indeed labelled
> ³whisky², but the SWA had their say about it, and they had to change it into
> scottish spirit.
> 
> Expect it to taste like a young islay should, an islay that is maybe a little
> ³green² because of it¹s youth. ;-)
> And I¹m sure they were not trying to hoodwink the customer! I think they saw
> it as a fun way of riding the wave of the ³finishes²!
> 
> My 2p,
> Paul
> 
> 
> On 30-08-2007 15:16, "Joe Barry" <jrsbar at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi all
>  
> My take on the use of C instead of K is the marketing geniuses way of covering
> their backs in case they were really accused of trying to hoodwink the
> customers.
>  
> Joe
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
> 
> 
>  
> On 8/30/07, Davin de Kergommeaux <maltmaniacsdavin at gmail.com> wrote:
> Yes Lex,
> 
> I pushed the send button too quickly.  Obviously if you as a biologist
> say it's elodia, it's elodia, but the pet store owners, who are not
> scientists, also call it elodia so that's the common name as well,
> which in my warped logic confirms that it's not seaweed and even the
> man in the street knows it.
> 
> Davin
> 
> 
> On 8/30/07, Kraaijeveld A.R. <A.R.Kraaijeveld at soton.ac.uk> wrote:
>> > Hi Davin
>> >
>> > I don't know why they chose the spelling Celp over Kelp. And yes, that's
>> > exactly the plant I mean.
>> >
>> >
>> > slainte, Lex
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>> >
>> > Fly, you greatest fool
>> > Why can't you say what they want you to
>> > Why can't you do what they taught you
>> > And show what they wanted of you
>> >
>> > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>> >
>> > Dr Alex R Kraaijeveld
>> > School of Biological Sciences
>> > University of Southampton
>> > Bassett Crescent East
>> > Southampton
>> > SO16 7PX
>> > United Kingdom
>> > tel: (+44)-(0)23-80593436
>> > fax: (+44)-(0)23-80594459
>> > http://www.sbs.soton.ac.uk/staff/ark/ark.php
>> <http://www.sbs.soton.ac.uk/staff/ark/ark.php>
>> >
>> > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>> >
>> >
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> > From: mm-malts-l-bounces at grsnet.net
>> > [mailto: mm-malts-l-bounces at grsnet.net
>> <mailto:mm-malts-l-bounces at grsnet.net> ] On Behalf Of Davin de Kergommeaux
>> > Sent: 30 August 2007 12:18
>> > To: MaltManiacs operated former 'MALT-L' Whisky List
>> > Subject: Re: [MM-MALTS-L] CELP & seaweed
>> >
>> > Hi Lex,
>> >
>> > Curious spelling.  Kelp, the seaweed, is spelled with a "K"
>> >
>> > The plant in the bottle looks quite like one you can buy at pet stores
>> > for your fresh water aquarium - and yes, if memory serves, I think it
>> > is called elodia.
>> >
>> > Davin
>> >
>> >
>> > On 8/30/07, Kraaijeveld A.R. <A.R.Kraaijeveld at soton.ac.uk> wrote:
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > > Hi Thomas
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > > The idea behind CELP is that, allegedly, in the old days seaweed was
>> > added
>>> > > to whisky on the islands for medicinal purposes. So CELP is said to
>> > recreate
>>> > > that old tradition. If we take that tradition as a given, then my
>> > problem is
>>> > > that it is strongly suggested that the plant in the bottle is seaweed,
>>> > > whereas it actually has nothing to do with seaweed whatsoever. So
>> > marketing
>>> > > trying to fool potential customers in thinking that there really is
>> > seaweed
>>> > > in the bottle. No doubt tasting notes will mention the saltyness,
>>> > > seaweedyness, etc. If there is a strong note of seaweed, it surely
>> > can't
>>> > > come from the plant in the bottle!
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > > slainte, Lex
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > > 
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >  Fly, you greatest fool
>>> > >  Why can't you say what they want you to
>>> > >  Why can't you do what they taught you
>>> > >  And show what they wanted of you
>>> > >
>>> > >  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > > Dr Alex R Kraaijeveld
>>> > >
>>> > > School of Biological Sciences
>>> > >
>>> > > University of Southampton
>>> > >
>>> > > Bassett Crescent East
>>> > >
>>> > > Southampton
>>> > >
>>> > > SO16 7PX
>>> > >
>>> > > United Kingdom
>>> > > 
>>> > > tel: (+44)-(0)23-80593436
>>> > >
>>> > > fax: (+44)-(0)23-80594459
>>> > >
>>> > > http://www.sbs.soton.ac.uk/staff/ark/ark.php
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >  ________________________________
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > > From: mm-malts-l-bounces at grsnet.net
>> > [mailto:mm-malts-l-bounces at grsnet.net]
>> <mailto:mm-malts-l-bounces at grsnet.net%5d>
>>> > > On Behalf Of Thomas Schubert
>>> > >  Sent: 30 August 2007 11:22
>>> > > 
>>> > >  To: MaltManiacs operated former 'MALT-L' Whisky List
>>> > >  Subject: Re: [MM-MALTS-L] CELP & seaweed
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > > Hi Lex,
>>> > >
>>> > >  I'm completely lost here.
>>> > >
>>> > >  What are the consequences of using waterweed rather than seaweed, and
>> > why
>>> > > should one add either to the liquid in the first place?
>>> > >
>>> > >  Thanks,
>>> > >
>>> > >  Thomas
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > > 2007/8/30, Kraaijeveld A.R. <A.R.Kraaijeveld at soton.ac.uk>:
>>> > >
>>> > > There are other species of seaweed, which are not solid sheets. So I
>>> > >  guess marketing was more important than honesty in this case. Suggest
>>> > >  the bottle contains seaweed and hope no one with a bit of botanical
>>> > >  knowledge will notice that it what's in the bottle has nothing to do
>>> > >  with seaweed ....
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >  slainte, Lex
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>>> > >
>>> > >  Fly, you greatest fool
>>> > >  Why can't you say what they want you to
>>> > >  Why can't you do what they taught you
>>> > >  And show what they wanted of you
>>> > > 
>>> > >  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>>> > >
>>> > >  Dr Alex R Kraaijeveld
>>> > >  School of Biological Sciences
>>> > >  University of Southampton
>>> > >  Bassett Crescent East
>>> > >  Southampton
>>> > >  SO16 7PX
>>> > >  United Kingdom
>>> > >  tel: (+44)-(0)23-80593436
>>> > >  fax: (+44)-(0)23-80594459
>>> > >  http://www.sbs.soton.ac.uk/staff/ark/ark.php
>>> <http://www.sbs.soton.ac.uk/staff/ark/ark.php>
>>> > >
>>> > >  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >  -----Original Message-----
>>> > >  From: mm-malts-l-bounces at grsnet.net
>>> <mailto:mm-malts-l-bounces at grsnet.net>
>>> > >  [mailto:mm-malts-l-bounces at grsnet.net]
>>> <mailto:mm-malts-l-bounces at grsnet.net%5d> On Behalf Of Michel van
>>> > >  Meersbergen
>>> > >  Sent: 30 August 2007 11:04
>>> > >  To: MaltManiacs operated former 'MALT-L' Whisky List
>>> > >  Subject: Re: [MM-MALTS-L] CELP & seaweed
>>> > >
>>> > >  Lex,
>>> > >
>>> > >  I'm affraid true celp wouldn't look as 'fancy' as whatever Elodea
>> > they
>>> > >  have 
>>> > >  put into the bottle. Just a vegetal green and rubbery 'sheet'. Celp
>>> > >  leaves
>>> > >  can be quite big.
>>> > >
>>> > >  For sure Van Wees/Ultimate outweirded Blackadder when it comes to
>> > solid
>>> > >  additives. :-)
>>> > >
>>> > >  Michel
>>> > >
>>> > >  P.s. No offense Rob!
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >  op 30-08-2007 11:52 schreef Kraaijeveld A.R. op
>>> > >  A.R.Kraaijeveld at soton.ac.uk:
>>> > >
>>>> > >  > Hi Michel
>>>> > >  >
>>>> > >  > Yes, 'waterpest' is exactly what I mean. I don't want to get into a
>>>> > >  > botanical discussion as to whether it's Elodea densa or Elodea
>>>> > >  > canadensis, because the two species are not always easy to tell
>> > apart.
>>>> > >  > What's important is that it appears that "Celp - The Seaweed
>>> > >  Experience"
>>>> > >  > does not contain any seaweed whatsoever.
>>>> > >  >
>>>> > >  >
>>>> > >  > slainte, Lex
>>>> > >  >
>>>> > >  > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>>>> > >  >
>>>> > >  > Fly, you greatest fool
>>>> > >  > Why can't you say what they want you to
>>>> > >  > Why can't you do what they taught you
>>>> > >  > And show what they wanted of you
>>>> > >  >
>>>> > >  > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>>>> > >  >
>>>> > >  > Dr Alex R Kraaijeveld
>>>> > >  > School of Biological Sciences
>>>> > >  > University of Southampton
>>>> > >  > Bassett Crescent East
>>>> > >  > Southampton
>>>> > >  > SO16 7PX
>>>> > >  > United Kingdom
>>>> > >  > tel: (+44)-(0)23-80593436
>>>> > >  > fax: (+44)-(0)23-80594459
>>>> > >  > http://www.sbs.soton.ac.uk/staff/ark/ark.php
>>>> > >  >
>>>> > >  > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>>>> > >  >
>>>> > >  > 
>>>> > >  > -----Original Message-----
>>>> > >  > From: mm-malts-l-bounces at grsnet.net
>>>> > >  > [mailto: mm-malts-l-bounces at grsnet.net
>>>> <mailto:mm-malts-l-bounces at grsnet.net> ] On Behalf Of Michel van
>>>> > >  > Meersbergen
>>>> > >  > Sent: 30 August 2007 09:51
>>>> > >  > To: MaltManiacs operated former 'MALT-L' Whisky List
>>>> > >  > Subject: Re: [MM-MALTS-L] CELP & seaweed
>>>> > >  >
>>>> > >  > Hi Lex,
>>>> > >  >
>>>> > >  > I had the same reservations when I saw the bottle for the first
>> > time.
>>>> > >  > It's
>>>> > >  > certainly not celp inside the bottle, I have it as Elodea
>> > canadensis
>>>> > >  > ('waterpest' as we say in Holland).
>>>> > >  >
>>>> > >  > AFAIK all the celp bottles have waterweed inside them.
>>>> > >  >
>>>> > >  > Best!
>>>> > >  >
>>>> > >  > Michel
>>>> > >  >
>>>> > >  >
>>>> > >  >
>>>> > >  > op 30-08-2007 10:31 schreef Kraaijeveld A.R. op
>>>> > >  > A.R.Kraaijeveld at soton.ac.uk:
>>>> > >  >
>>>>> > >  >> Hi all
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >> I got a bottle of "CELP - Seaweed Experience" for a tasting I'll
>> > be
>>>>> > >  >> running at the university later this year. For those who have
>> > never
>>>>> > >  >> heard of this one, it's either a young Lagavulin or a vatting of
>>>>> > >  >> Lagavulin and Laphroaig to which seaweed is added. So legally it's
>>> > >  not
>>>>> > >  >> whisky anymore and the label doesn't claim that it is.
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >> The spirit is clearly greenish and there is a twig of a plant
>>> > >  floating
>>>>> > >  >> in the bottle (bottle won't be opened until the tasting). Now as
>> > soon
>>>> > >  > as
>>>>> > >  >> I saw the twig, I got suspicious. To me, the plant which is
>> > floating
>>>> > >  > in
>>>>> > >  >> the bottle looks remarkably like Common or Brazilian Waterweed,
>> > which
>>>> > >  > is
>>>>> > >  >> a very common freshwater plant. Does not grow in the sea and is
>> > not a
>>>>> > >  >> seaweed by any stretch of the (botanical) imagination. I've
>> > attached
>>> > >  a
>>>>> > >  >> small picture of this plant and I'm asking those of you who
>> > have/had
>>> > >  a
>>>>> > >  >> bottle of CELP to tell me whether the plant inside the bottle
>> > looks
>>>> > >  > like
>>>>> > >  >> the plant in the picture. Just so I know whether all CELP bottles
>>>>> > >  >> contain waterweed rather than a seaweed or whether there ARE
>> > indeed
>>>> > >  > CELP
>>>>> > >  >> bottles with (possible) seaweed.
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >> 
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >> slainte, Lex
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >> Fly, you greatest fool
>>>>> > >  >> Why can't you say what they want you to
>>>>> > >  >> Why can't you do what they taught you
>>>>> > >  >> And show what they wanted of you
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >> Dr Alex R Kraaijeveld
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >> School of Biological Sciences
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >> University of Southampton
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >> Bassett Crescent East
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >> Southampton
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >> SO16 7PX
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >> United Kingdom
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >> tel: (+44)-(0)23-80593436
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >> fax: (+44)-(0)23-80594459
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >> http://www.sbs.soton.ac.uk/staff/ark/ark.php
>>>>> > >  >> <http://www.sbs.soton.ac.uk/staff/ark/ark.php >
>>>>> <http://www.sbs.soton.ac.uk/staff/ark/ark.php%20>
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >> 
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >>
>>>>> > >  >> _______________________________________________
>>>>> > >  >> MM-MALTS-L mailing list
>>>>> > >  >> MM-MALTS-L at grsnet.net
>>>>> > >  >> http://lists.grsnet.net/mailman/listinfo/mm-malts-l
>>>>> <http://lists.grsnet.net/mailman/listinfo/mm-malts-l>
>>>> > >  >
>>>> > >  >
>>>> > >  > _______________________________________________
>>>> > >  > MM-MALTS-L mailing list
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>>>> > >  > http://lists.grsnet.net/mailman/listinfo/mm-malts-l
>>>> > >  >
>>>> > >  >
>>>> > >  > _______________________________________________
>>>> > >  > MM-MALTS-L mailing list
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>>>> > >  >
>>>> > >  >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >  _______________________________________________
>>> > >  MM-MALTS-L mailing list
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>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > >  --
>>> > >  Thomas Schubert
>>> > >
>>> > >  potstill.de <http://potstill.de>  | distillerylane.de
>>> <http://distillerylane.de>  | thomasschubert.eu
>>> > >  Fax/VM: +49 69 13304197006 | Skype:potstill
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